new york times and chicago tribune sued Perplexity last week, the latest in a series of publishers suing AI companies to set boundaries around new information-enabled technologies.
Alsa Chan, host:
The New York Times and Chicago Tribune sued artificial intelligence company Perplexity AI. These were separate copyright infringement lawsuits filed last week. And these are the latest in a series of lawsuits against AI companies by media companies seeking to protect their business models. To explain all this, we talk to NPR's John Ruwitch. Hello John.
JOHN RUWICH, BYLINE: Hi, Ailsa.
CHANG: So please explain exactly what's at the heart of these latest incidents.
Luwich: Well, the real question is who can reuse content published on the Internet by news companies and under what circumstances. Perplexity is one of the most popular AI chatbots, along with ChatGPT and Google's Gemini. These chatbots are trained based on data obtained from the internet. Ask questions and get AI-powered answers. But in short, these news companies are accusing Perplexity of using their content without permission to create some of those answers. Steven Lieberman is an attorney with Rothwell Figg. He is president of the New York Times and Chicago Tribune. He argues that Perplexity should pay for its content, just as other types of companies have done for years.
Steven Lieberman: For example, when it comes to television, one of the most popular early shows was “I Love Lucy” on CBS. But CBS didn't adapt the “I Love Lucy” content without paying Lucille Ball and Desi Arnaz. They paid for the content.
CHANG: So how did Perplexity respond to this?
Ruwitch: Well, Perplexity downplayed that in a statement they sent to journalists. Jesse Dwyer, the company's communications director, said the publisher has been suing emerging technology companies for 100 years. And he said, “Fortunately, that never worked out, otherwise we would have been talking about this on the wire.''
Chan: (laughs).
Ruwich: That was a bit mean.
Chan: That's right (lol).
Ruwich: But at the heart of these debates, yeah, the heart of it is generally the question of what counts as fair use, or what should be considered fair use, and whether AI is going to change things. Fair use is a legal concept that allows others to conditionally use a copyrighted work without the owner's consent, such as for educational or research purposes. Therefore, it must be changed to something new.
Chan: Yes.
Ruwich: I talked to Sarah Kreps about this. She heads Cornell University's Technology Policy Institute. She says AI companies are really testing the boundaries of fair use by looking at all the data and content available.
Sarah Krebs: With new technologies, it's not entirely clear what the boundaries are. So it's no surprise that they try to push the limits and find out.
Luwich: That's basically because the competition in AI is fierce. AI models are built on data. The more data you have, the better your model will be.
CHANG: Okay, John, with all this talk about AI, it feels like we keep hearing that AI is a threat to this, or that AI is going to destroy it. So let's get really specific here. Why is AI such a threat to these media companies?
Ruwich: For media companies, it's almost an existential issue, right? They are in the business of creating news content and selling it. And analysts say the harsh lessons of the past are actually helping to galvanize some of these cases. Ailsa, you remember how the internet fundamentally changed the news industry, right?
Chan: Oh, that's right.
Luwich: Cut advertising revenue, put many newspapers out of business, and give customers a new way to get their news for free. News companies don't want something like this to happen again. Klaudia Jazwinska is a researcher and journalist at Columbia University's Tow Center for Digital Journalism.
KLAUDIA JAZWINSKA: I think a lot of publishers feel like they've come under fire in the past. And they don't see any reason to trust AI companies or technology platforms.
RUWICH: She and her colleagues actually launched the online tracker last week. And she has tallied about 20 lawsuits so far (she says there could be more), and more than 100 where media companies get paid for their content through licensing or revenue-sharing agreements.
CHANG: Do you think there will be more deals?
Ruwitch: Maybe so. Steven Lieberman, the newspaper's lawyer, says that's where things should go. Both sides will eventually need to sit down and finalize a licensing agreement. However, these things take time. The case is progressing well in court. The original first product was launched about two years ago. It was The New York Times vs. OpenAI. And so far there is no end in sight to this case.
CHANG: That's NPR's John Ruwich in Silicon Valley. Thank you, John.
Luwich: You're welcome.
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